KARLA TURNER CLASS LOG, 2.22.95

2/22/95 5:59:05 PM Opening "Class #2 Log 2/22/95" for recording.

ThunderK : Hi, folks! Glad you're here tonight.

Dee777 : Wouldn't miss it! Thanks!

ThunderK : By the way, Dee, I was just given the name of a person who may be a blind abductee, but I haven't made any contact yet. ga

Barb Byrd : Karla, looking forward to meeting you at the Ozark conference in April!

Dee777 : I wish you luck. That could be an important breakthrough. Lood Luck. GA

ThunderK : So you're coming? Great, it will be a good opportunity to meet a lot of folks from all over the country, and the speakers usually have plenty of up-to-date info.

Dee777 : Karla: My friend Bonnie will be at the ozark conference. Would you like to meet her? ga

ThunderK : Sure, Dee, I'll be speaking and also at one of the vendor areas, so tell her to stop by and introduce herself. Hello, Wayne.

TX90829 : Hello, Dr. Turner ga

Dee777 : I will do that Karla. She'll appreciate it so much. Ga

ThunderK : Is anyone else planning to attend the Ozark Conference, by the way?

Dee777 : I'm certain you'll have a lot of Wisconsin and Illinois people we know from here. ga.

ThunderK : Guess not. Hi, Toney and Bob. Until we start the main discussion, does anyone have preliminary comments or questions? ga

Terra Alta : Hi! It's good to be back!

Dee777 : I woke up with a triangle itchy spots on my hand this week. It swelled up really big. Don't know if that's significant. ga.

ThunderK : Was there any other unusual activity during the night? ga

Dee777 : Just my usual strange dreams. ga.

ThunderK : Anyone else have comments? ga

TX90829 : I am still looking for the g-men abducting implant info for you Dr. Turner.

ThunderK : Thanks, Wayne, you can e-mail short items and send a folder of anything lengthier. One quick question before class begins. I haven't asked for anyone to discuss their own alien encounters although some of you have been very open about your experiences and I expect that all members of this group will respect the confidentiality of anything personal which is shared in the course of our discussions. Agreed? ga

(ED. note- That goes for any AIC members reading this as well! <G> John)

Dee777 : Agreed! ga.

ThunderK : Yes, Irene? ga

TX90829 : agreed, ga.

Terra Alta : Yup.

IreneR757 : There was just an abductee rice krispies commercial on. ga

ThunderK : Yes, I was told about it but haven't seen it yet. I'm still blown away by the one for Stovetop Stuffing! Hope you've all seen it. Time for one last freebie before I start the discussion. Anyone, ga?

ISCNIAcad : ?

ThunderK : Yes, Jim? ga

ISCNIAcad : Is it awfully conspiratorial to think that all these advertisers are doing this is concert?

ThunderK : Well, it's certainly true that some of the major corporate interests have promoted the UFO and alien motifs in widespread advertising, and they don't spend their money heedlessly, do you think? Anyone have a response to this? ga

Density 4 : Stepping up the "drip feed campaign" you mean...?

ThunderK : The 'public preparation' agenda, Devin? ga

Density 4 : yup ga

ThunderK : Is that conspiratorial thinking? ga anyone

IreneR757 : !

ThunderK : Yes, Irene. ga

Dee777 : !

IreneR757 : in my collegeradical days I learned just how far the govt and big business are capable of going to promote what ever it is they please, the stories of GM and Standard oil buying out all of the trollies for example the list is endless, why should this be any different? ga

ThunderK : We'd want to look at the motives of big business and its relation to this phenomenon in more detail, if we want to get a bigger view, which is why I've started a mini-topic folder operative in April, on the connections between corporate interests and the UFO/alien scenario. So if anyone is interested, that's where to share your ideas. Yes, Dee? ga

Dee777 : My local UFO group has been approaced by a film crew from out East to interview people in our group, not just because of the UFO connection but because we have members of many colors and they wanted to show an ethnicity for a CNN covereage program. ga.

ThunderK : Interesting! Let us know what happens and when it will be broadcast, please. For now, let's get started with our final set of topics for the course, which are non-reproductive physical procedures, implants, and virtual-reality capabilities. We're familiar with the genetics procedures and fetal extractions, but there are a number of other physical procedures regularly reported by abductees. What, for instance, can you recall? ga

Dee777 : !

ThunderK : Yes, Dee? ga

Dee777 : I've had several surgeries on my head, in the back. ga.

ThunderK : Right, this is a more common report than the general literature reflects and many abductees describe it in almost identical terms saying, "They opened my head and removed my brain." Yet we don't find any scars from these procedures afterwards. What other procedures are there? ga

ThunderK : Yes, Barb, ga

Barb Byrd : I've heard of abductees receiving healings of various sorts. ga

ThunderK : Okay, this is part of the data and some of the reports are very impressive when it comes to medical verification but they aren't statistically a significant part of the reported procedures. Yes, Mitch? ga

IreneR757 : !

ThunderK : Mitch just got punted, so go ahead, Irene.

IreneR757 : Scoop marks, needles in the abdomen we have both had unusual scars. ga

ThunderK : Yes, and some of these marks may be explained as part of the genetics work, as with the needle intrusions into the navel and over the ovaries, and the scoop marks may be samples used for genetics work, too. Mitch, you had a comment? ga

Bandrsntch : never mind I got thrown out.ga

ThunderK : Go ahead if you'd like? All right, Terra Alta, I think you were next. ga

Terra Alta : An abductee I'm working with (recalls 1500 abductions) reports very little surgical intrusion, but a massive amount of "tuning" on his system for the purpose of being a conduit for energy certainly not a statistical category, but an interesting report nonetheless.ga

Bandrsntch : There are reports of implants to increase the abductees level of awareness.ga

ThunderK : Both interesting aspects! I'll respond to you first, Mitch, because we will be discussing the implants separately a bit later tonight and this should be part of that. As for the physical 'tuning' of abductees, yes, these reports are tantalizing because if something physical is indeed being altered, there should be some way to test and analyze body tissues and functions to confirm this but I don't, so far, know of any group funding such a study. Yes, Irene?

IreneR757 : When I was in Rachel Nevada visiting Glenn Campbell he said there were physical tests that are being
developed to prove the existance of UFO sites and we talked about the possibility of testing abductees in the same sort of way. I know I have physical after effects such as a metalic taste in my mouth and a very hungover feeling these things should be somehow measurable. I have offered over the net to make myself available for this kind of testing but have had no takers. ga

KnoSys : Sorry I'm late, Teach, had to help Ma burn the pine needles.

ThunderK : I remember reading that! Of course, funding is scarce, and the real research carried out is under R&D auspices, for the most part and won't be made available to the public so it's unlikely that any known group of abductees will be openly tested. Hi, KnoSys, we are looking at non-reproductive physical procedures reported as part of abduction events. Besides the brain procedures, there are also frequent reports of the body being scanned by various equipment. Do you know of such instruments in the reports? Yes, Dee, ga

Dee777 : My friend Bonnie has had implants put on over the corneas of her eyes which cause her to see energies in the next dimensions all the time. ga.

ThunderK : Has any doctor examined her eyes and confirmed this? ga

Dee777 : Yes! She went to her opthamologist because she can't see clearly in the physical now. ga.

ThunderK : Has the doctor confirmed the presence of artificial 'implant' materials on her eyes? ga

Toneyterry : !

Dee777 : The doctor was shocked to see her eyes, and asked her if she had had her eyes implanted.ga

ThunderK : Yes, Toney? ga

Toneyterry : Theres a man at M.I.T that specializes in implants I think his name is Pritcher(Spelling)ga

KnoSys : Pritchard?

ThunderK : Right, and perhaps Michael could find out if there have been any recent reports on implant analyses. Another physical procedure is the insertion of wires or tubes into the abductee's wrist, knees, feet, and several other locations not directly related to reproduction. And also, perhaps the most 'classic' procedure reported, the taking of samples of skin, hair, and fingernails. Yes, Dee? ga

Dee777 : I hate to be redundant, but Bonnie and I both had something with wires inserted between the ribs on the right side on the same day a couple of weeks ago. ga.

ThunderK : I'm not surprised by such reports any more, Dee, they are so frequent, and yet we still don't know what purpose they serve. People often say that some liquid is either injected or removed by the tubes, but explanations are hardly ever given. A similar reported procedure is the forced ingestion of a substance or liquid which has various descriptions. The liquid is typically associated with a subsequent alteration of some sort in the abductee. Yes, Dee, ga

Dee777 : I was injected with some chemical about 8 years ago to test my immune system which caused my health to downslide a great deal. They come back every so often to check how my immune system is healing itself. ga.

ThunderK : Two things in response: first, yes, when the aliens do give an explanation, it often has something to do with our immune system, or with changing some 'frequency' or 'vibration' in our bodies, but as of yet we have not externally confirmed that this is indeed the real nature of their procedures, as we cannot objectively monitor the events. Second, from your statement I assume that you've had some health problems in the course of your alien experiences, and I would point out that to be honest, especially for women, these events seem to lead to health problems. Typically, these are gynecological, and some of them are unexplained. Yes, Charley? ga

KnoSys : I was zapped with a blue-colored ray in the right upper chest, to correct a problem there, they said. But it is difficult to correlate this sort of thing with regular, Western medicine, or confirm it. ga

ThunderK : Were you aware of a problem in that area before this event? ga

KnoSys : Yes, a very long-term, that is, chronic problem. ga

ThunderK : How is the problem now? ga

KnoSys : It seems to have "rebalanced" itself. ga

ThunderK : Excellent! Perhaps this is one that should go in the 'healing' category. Looking at these various procedures, can you reasonably explain them in terms of any of the traditional abduction theories? ga anyone?

Density 4 : !

ThunderK : Yes, Devin, ga

Density 4 : Just a guess- keep them "containers" in tip top shape so they can keep "mining" them for sperm, ova, etc.
whatever or to make it *APPEAR* that they are friendly and well intentioned? ga

ThunderK : Okay, but it's just not the case that all abductees have good health, as I was saying so that isn't a widespread concern. However, given your premise of mining, could it be that the gynecological problems could stem from repeated mining forays into the women's reproductive areas? Any responses? ga

Density 4 : !

ThunderK : Yes, Devin, ga

ISCNIAcad : !

Density 4 : As an aside, I have never heard of the aliens "cleansing" their ubiquitous "anal probes" between use on various folks...

KnoSys : oh my

Density 4 : as we would expect a dentist to clean his instruments or a gynecologist, surgeon, etc. ga

ThunderK : Yes, and this concern has been voiced by many abductees as has a concern about possible disease transmission from the forced sexual encounters some of them go through. Yes, Jim? ga

IreneR757 : eewww!

ISCNIAcad : If they're creating a master race of chosen people after humans destroy the planet, all of this would make sense as general physical research, wouldn't it? The more they know the better, so to speak. ga

Dee777 : !

ThunderK : Perhaps, but they've been doing this 'research' for a long, long time and must be pretty dense not to have learned enough by now. Dee, can your comment wait long enough for me to get to the next topic: ga

KnoSys : Which suggests it's not research.

ThunderK : Thanks! Our time is running out quickly, and I want to at least touch on the other two topics, starting with the implants. Typical reports tell of small devices inserted into different parts of the abductee's body such as the nose, ear, neck, spine, and eye socket but isolated instances have included other areas too. Sometimes these devices actually appear on X-rays and MRI scans, but usually the recalled implant does not show up when the area is rescanned. Some possible implants have been recovered, usually accidentally, and in cases where they have been analyzed, the materials typically are quite terrestrial, but sometimes the combinations of elements are unusual. Yes, Irene? ga

IreneR757 : are there really implants in someones possesion? one hears rumors. of what "terrestrial" nature are they ga

ThunderK : There are alleged implants, which is the best I can say objects that are not identifiable in usual terms, but with terrestrial elements. Still, none that I know of has been convincingly shown to be of non-human manufacture nor, however, has a terrestrial source been conclusively identified, so the question of authenticity is still up in the air. To continue about the implants, there are several explanations of their functions offered both by the aliens and by the abductees usually, they say, based on their intuitive sense of the objects. What functions are you already familiar with, from the available literature? ga

IreneR757 : !

ThunderK : Yes, Irene, ga

IreneR757 : tracking. one time I woke up with the feeling that I had been hit in the face with a hammer and a couple of minutes later something flew over really low and fast. ga

ThunderK : Why do you associate that experience with an implant and with tracking? ga

Toneyterry : ?

IreneR757 : Because the pain was very localized in the area that always "creaks" after an 'experience' this same area was so infected after a sighting I had in 1967 that I was almost hospiatlized for it. I guess actually though my reaction is strictly emotional. ga